Michael Trainer on Building a Village, Strong Relationships & Biohacking


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Katie: Hello, and welcome to the “Valence Mama Podcast.” I’m from KatieWellensmama.com and Wellensy.com. That’s the decent thing to do, and it should end there. This is my new line of non-toxic natural personal care products.

Today I am with Michael Trainer, a widely recognized social impact businessman around the world. He is the co-creator of something called Global Citizen, a movement dedicated to the eradication of extreme poverty. He is also the creator of Top Brain, which brings together thinking leaders to inspire a new vision of leadership. And he is also a famous bio hacker. And we are among its 80/20 top tips in many other areas as well as living a healthier life. So recording this is a really fun event and I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. Michael, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for coming here

Michael: It’s an honor to be on your show.

Katie: I’m so excited to chat with you today. I think there are different directions we can and probably will take. But to begin with, for everyone who is not yet familiar with you, can you give us a little bit of your background, in particular, maybe Global Citizen and what it is, and how it happened?

Michael: Of course. Yes, global citizenship is indeed a movement to end extreme poverty. There has been a significant increase. In the last decade we have been fortunate that almost in commitment to programs to serve the world’s poor. Save 40 billion. But the impetus was to create a movement of active citizens around our common humanity. And for me, I lived in Sri Lanka for two years, and was first exposed to extreme poverty at a very young age. And really, the bottom line is that what we wanted to do with Global Citizen was to change the story. You know, we wanted to get away from guilt and embarrassment, you know, like Sally Sterly Thurs. We call it a kind of poverty porn, where you turn on your television, and they tell you to give up your cup of coffee, and in Africa we show you a poor kid with a fly around. Is. We really wanted to promote the idea of ​​our shared potential, and if we were currently living in extreme poverty with 1.4 billion people living below 1. 25.25 a day, we would make them extremely poor. What can be done to help lift people out of poverty? And if we take care of the less fortunate among us, we will all benefit from a common humanity.

Katie: I like it. So how did you guys do it? From what I’ve read about your bio, it’s been an impressive, large-scale endeavor.

Michael: Yeah, so that was quite a miracle. I think, in a lot of cases, the reason is this; you know, I think, whatever you build, obviously, has to start with vision and determination, and some people who are into it. They are willing to give their heart and soul. And we started with a very small team. And it’s a long story, but the short version is that in nine months, we’ve been able to move on from the beginning of the idea to our first festival, and we decided to use a festival because music is such a universal language. And we wanted to inspire people with that hope and inspiration. And the best thing we did, we made it so we wouldn’t ask you for money. We demanded your action instead. And the way you got tickets to the Global Citizen Festival, you really have to deal with the issues that are affecting the growth. So, maybe you use a piece of content and share it with your friends or sign a request, which basically, we’ll use because we collect hundreds of thousands of functions, and now millions of functions. And then we’ll use it to get the leaders of large-scale corporations or heads of state to make declarative promises on behalf of the world’s poorest people. So, year 1, we were lucky enough to host Neil Young, The Black Keys’, Fu Fighters, John Legend, Imagine Singing, Pin intended, you could imagine it was quite spectacular, the Beatles Never had a chance to perform. Great lawn in Central Park.

So we took the Great Lawn, which is challenging and very few artists are able to perform there because you have to have free tickets to the events. And so we turn to this challenge because hosting an event on the Great Lawn is quite expensive, as you can imagine with the police force and union labor, etc., and we use it to our great advantage. Do And it was the impetus for the development of the digital platform, which has now come to the festival around the world as a way to raise awareness and influence both, and then to spread this informed movement to communities around the world. To translate into concrete promises. So it has grown. I left after the third year when my father was unfortunately diagnosed with dementia. However, in Year 1, we were able to get وعد 1.3 billion in new commitments, you know. And now, over the past decade, they’ve raised about 40 40 billion. And we have festivals all over the world. I flew to South Africa around Nelson Mandela’s 100th birthday, which was incredible. You know, the opera was there, Tyler Perry, Cold Play, Beyonce. It was really, really incredible. So, it’s basically a movement of everyday citizens, marching through their favorite artists who can form a movement around our common humanity.

Katie: That’s incredible. What do you see as the needle’s biggest stimulus in advancing the global poverty alleviation challenge?

Michael: Well, as it relates to poverty, you know, I think we’re moving in a clear, one way; you know, Terrence McKenna said the world is a thousand years old. That has changed since 1992. And I think in many ways that is justified by the advent of digital technology and the fact that many of us have smartphones that let us know that many previous presidents have access to much more information. Is. So I think its concentration is an evolution because it has to do with technology. I think much of it depends on political will. And I think a lot of that also depends on the ways in which we can create more equitable technologies. You know, I sometimes tell stories where, you know, I say, you know, “Can we agree that Bill Gates is a talented person?” And most people agree that he is talented. I say, “Well, well, even if he’s one in a million,” which I don’t think he is, but we say he’s one in a million. If you follow the Malcolm Gladwell principle of having 10,000 hours on a device to get a master’s degree, he had 10,000 hours on a supercomputer and very rare access to that computer when he was very young. So if you combine talent with opportunity, it’s something that can change our whole life, right? Because the advent of the personal computer has changed our whole life. And now, of course, Bill Gates has created the Gates Foundation, the largest multi-billion dollar philanthropic foundation. And besides, you know, he made a commitment, which I think has raised 600 600 billion so far. So this is just one person who got the opportunity along with his ability. And so if you take the 1.4 billion people around the world, who are less now, thank goodness, these are the 1,400 other Bill Gates who can revolutionize our lives, collectively, all over the world, why? What we are now being shown by the corona virus, you know, is that one person’s breath or action can affect every other person’s life all over the world.

And so I believe we can, and we should see to it that everyone has equal access to opportunity. And a lot of it has to do with building basic infrastructure and lifting people out of extreme poverty. So I think it could be the legacy of our generation. You know, the goal of Global Citizen is to see it fulfilled by 2030. And I think that’s possible. I think it could be a great victory for our generation. Now, the question is, if we can create this opportunity, what will we do with it? And I hope we can create many different technologies. And one thing I do know is that you and I both have a passion for each other. It’s also important to see that there are more healthcare opportunities, so that not only do people have the opportunity to free up their businesses. Hopefully, they can take care of their health and well-being. Because as we know, you know, a long study of Harvard, you know, is basically the greatest wealth and the greatest partner in our long-term health and happiness is the strength of our relationship. And I think the biggest fact is that if we can combine great relationships with great health and great opportunities, we have developed a context for an equal life that I think this planet Every human being deserves.

Katie: Absolutely. I definitely want to talk deeply about some biological issues, and we’re going to go there. But first, I understand that the natural class in it is another thing that, I think, right now is a focus for you, from the work I’ve read about you in your work, called Peak Brain. Is. So I wish you could get us through it and encourage it.

Michael: Yeah, so there’s Peck Mind; so, the personal side of this story is my dad when I was building a Global Citizen with an incredible team that we put together, unfortunately, fighting prostate cancer. Which, of course, made the video an overnight sensation. He was then diagnosed with dementia and cognitive decline after the second fair. And as you know, there is really no cure for dementia. And so, it was really a wake-up call for me. And I actually think, in some ways, a great gift that he gave me because I went to work, you know, 14 hours a day, 16 hours a day and the candle is lit at both ends. Am Just saying, “Dad, you know, I want to do something while we can still create memories. And so I said, I’ll take you anywhere in the world where you want to go. And he’s a very modest man, so he never asked me to take him anywhere, but I decided to surprise him, and I took him to South Africa, and I knew he was. Loves history. I knew he loved nature. And that’s one of the best things I’ve ever done. I think when you can take your parents on a special experience, It’s really meaningful, given all the sacrifices you know, made in their lives, and it was time for our lives. And on this journey, I decided it was time to leave Global Citizen. You know, Global Citizen was very financially strong and growing very well. And I knew I wanted to spend as much time with it as possible. And so, I decided to leave and I meditated for 30 days Of And on the 30th day, I had such a crazy idea that I wanted to do an event to host His Holiness, the Dalai Lama, because I have seen so much research around the benefits of meditation.

You know, Harvard just released research that showed that you can literally make up your mind in eight weeks, you know, you can reduce the size and activity of your amygdala, you know, your The hippocampus, you know, is the center of your fight or flight in the brain and the increase in its size and activity, you know, is the center of creativity and potential. And so I thought, “Holy, who can be more representative than the Dalai Lama?” And, you know, with Global Citizen, I had a great experience attracting you, you know, such notable personalities that you know, can be very valuable in attracting attention, and Through, will bring many people into the tent, so to speak. And so, in 2015, I had the good fortune to do this seven months later, after this approach and again working, you know, working tirelessly to strengthen it, on his 80th birthday. On the occasion, His Excellency, the host of the Dalai Lama, is here in Los Angeles. And we did an incredible thing, which is actually available. This is the first episode of my podcast where I took this recording and presented it to the world, but an incredible conversation with the Dalai Lama about the virtue and value of meditation and mindfulness. And that was the unveiling of Peck Mind, which has really grown in both events. So I have been lucky to host people like Deepak Chopra and Ekchart Tole. We had an event in LA for 5,000 people with less code than ever before, as well as the launch of the Peak Mine podcast, where I’ve been fortunate to host many of the great leaders of our time, you know. Ho, by his consecration, from President Carter to the Dalai Lama, and then to many leaders in the field of health and well-being, that I know you are an incredible expert. I would love to meet you at some point.

But still, you know, your Dr. Mark Hyman, your actors like Lord Hamilton, Maria Sharapova, you know, Wim Hoff, in the minds of a variety of different leaders, really with the idea that we’re going to change internally. It is necessary to create to see how. A more just and equal world? As I think with global citizens, we have become a great tool for changing the world through policy, and business and leisure. اور مجھے لگتا ہے کہ پییک مائنڈ کے ساتھ ، میرا وژن یہ ہے کہ واقعتا inner داخلی تبدیلی کے لئے اس تناظر کو تیار کیا جائے کیونکہ یہ میرا عقیدہ ہے کہ آخر کار ، دنیا ہماری اجتماعی داخلی حالتوں کا مظہر ہے۔ اور جب تک ہم گھر کو صاف نہیں کرسکتے ہیں ، لہذا بات کرنے کے لئے ، گھر کے اندر ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ دنیا میں پائیدار تبدیلی لانا بہت مشکل ہے ، آپ جانتے ہو ، ایک کراس مشابہت جس کا میں کبھی کبھی اشتراک کرتا ہوں۔ لیکن ، آپ جانتے ہو ، لاٹری کا فاتح لیں۔ بہت سے لاٹری جیتنے والے ، آپ جانتے ہو ، فنانس یا پیشہ ورانہ کھلاڑیوں کا ونڈ فال حاصل کرتے ہیں ، لیکن اس کے بعد ، آپ کو معلوم ہوگا ، 80٪ کی طرح ، ان کی طے شدہ آمدنی میں واپس جائیں اور / یا دیوالیہ ہوجائیں۔ کیوں؟ کیونکہ ان کے پاس ابھی تک اس تبدیلی والے دولت کو رکھنے کے لئے ذہنیت نہیں ہے۔ اور اس لئے چوٹی دماغ کے ساتھ ویژن واقعتا trans تبدیلی کا سیاق و سباق پیدا کرنا ہے ، اس قابل بننے کے ل you ، آپ جانتے ہو ، ہم اپنی زندگی میں جس قسم کی تبدیلی لانا چاہتے ہیں اسے پائیدار بننا ہے۔

کیٹی: ہاں ، اور مجھے کچھ بھی پسند ہے جو آپ کے ساتھ ان دونوں منصوبوں کی مشترکات کی طرح لگتا ہے کہ آپ ایسے منصوبوں سے نمٹ رہے ہیں جو بہت سارے لوگوں کے لئے ناقابل تسخیر لگتے ہیں۔ آپ واقعی بڑے پیمانے پر دشواریوں سے نپٹ رہے ہیں۔ اور ہمارے کنبے میں ، ہمارا کاروبار میں بہت زیادہ فوکس ہے۔ اور بطور کنبہ یہ ہماری بنیادی اقدار میں سے ایک ہے اور ایسی کوئی چیز جسے ہم اپنے بچوں تک پہنچانے کی کوشش میں بہت زیادہ شعور رکھتے ہیں۔ اور یہ وہ چیز ہے جو میں انہیں اکثر کہتا ہوں ، یہ ہے کہ بعض اوقات بڑے مسائل کو اپنے طریقے سے حل کرنے کی کوشش کرنے سے کہیں زیادہ بڑے طریقے سے حل کرنا آسان ہوجاتا ہے۔ اور بہت ساری بار ، مجھے ایسا لگتا ہے جیسے لوگ ان واقعات سے نمٹنے میں ہچکچاتے ہیں جیسے واقعی بڑے پیمانے پر دشواریوں کی طرح لگتا ہے کیونکہ ہمیں صرف شبہ ہے کہ ہم واقعی یہ کر سکتے ہیں۔ لہذا میں نے ان دونوں واقعات میں ، آپ کو پہلے سے ہی بڑے پیمانے پر پریشانیوں سے نپٹا لیا ، اور ہم واقعتا big بڑے لوگوں کو آپ کے ساتھ ملنے اور اس میں بڑے پیمانے پر تبدیلی پیدا کرنا شروع کرنے کے قابل ہو گئے۔ کیا آپ کے پاس ان لوگوں کے لئے کوئی نکات ہیں جو ان کی مختلف صنعت یا علاقہ ہے جس میں اسی طرح کی تبدیلی پیدا کرنے کی کوشش کر رہے ہیں؟

مائیکل: ضرور ہاں ٹھیک ہے ، سب سے پہلے ، میں محبت کرتا ہوں کہ آپ اپنے بچوں کو کاروبار کے بارے میں تعلیم دے رہے ہیں۔ میرے خیال میں یہ ایک سب سے بڑا تحفہ ہے جو ہم اپنے بچوں پر پیش کر سکتے ہیں۔ اور میں سوچتا ہوں کہ جیسے ہی ہم اس نئی نسل میں منتقل ہورہے ہیں ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ بہت سارے ماڈلز اور میکانزم جو ہم نے لئے ہیں ، انھیں ارتقا کی ضرورت ہے۔ اور مجھے لگتا ہے کہ ہمیں نوجوان کاروباری افراد کی نسل کی ضرورت ہوگی۔ لہذا میں بہت شکرگزار ہوں کہ آپ یہ کر رہے ہیں۔ میں کہوں گا جو اشارے میرے پاس واقعتا are ہیں ، آپ جانتے ہیں ، میں جس معمولی انداز میں تبدیلی لانے میں کامیاب رہا ہوں ، وہ واقعتا great عظیم رشتوں کے گرد گھوما ہوا ہے۔ تم جانتے ہو ، مجھے لگتا ہے… اور یہ ایک ایسی کتاب ہے جس پر میں فی الحال کام کر رہا ہوں۔ لیکن مجھے آخر کار محسوس ہوتا ہے ، اگر آپ کے پاس بہت بڑا نظریہ ہے ، جو میرے خیال میں بہت سارے لوگ کرتے ہیں ، اور سوال یہ ہے … اور ویسے ، جیسے ، جب میں ان کاروباری اداروں کو شروع کر رہا تھا تب بھی ، مجھے کامیابی کے بارے میں خوف اور غداری تھی۔ اور روح کے اندھیرے راتوں کی طرح کئی بار تھے جب یہ سوالیہ نظر آتا تھا کہ اس کا احساس ہوجائے گا۔ لیکن ہر ایک صورتحال میں ، یہ ناقابل یقین لوگوں کی ایک چھوٹی سی ٹیم کی اجتماعی کاوش کا احساس ہوا۔ آپ جانتے ہو ، وہاں وہ مارگریٹ میڈ حوالہ ہے جس سے مجھے پیار ہے ، جو آپ جانتے ہیں ، “کبھی بھی لوگوں کے چھوٹے گروہ کی طاقت پر شک نہ کریں جنہوں نے دنیا کو بدلا۔” اور واقعتا، ، یہ صرف وہی ایک چیز ہے جو کبھی کرتی ہے ، آپ جانتے ہیں۔ اور میں سمجھتا ہوں کہ جس ڈگری تک آپ لوگوں کو ڈھونڈ سکتے ہیں جس پر آپ اعتماد کرتے ہیں ، جو ایک جڑے ہوئے وژن اور اقدار کا مشترکہ ہے وہ ڈگری ہے جس پر آپ غیر معمولی تبدیلی اور اثر و رسوخ ظاہر کرسکتے ہیں۔ اور اسی طرح ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ ، آپ جانتے ہیں ، میں واقعتا رشتوں کی طاقت کا ایک بہت بڑا پرستار ہوں اور واقعتا stock اس بات کا جائزہ لے رہا ہوں کہ کس طرح انتہائی موثر تعلقات استوار کیے جائیں۔

میرے خیال میں ، ہمارے کچھ نمونے ٹوٹ چکے ہیں۔ آپ جانتے ہو ، میں سمجھتا ہوں کہ ہمارا صحت کی دیکھ بھال کا نظام ، ہمارا تعلیمی نظام ، ان میں سے بہت سارے نظام 20 ویں صدی کے صنعتی سرمایہ داری کے آثار ہیں ، جو واقعی میں ہے ، میں سوچتا ہوں کہ صنعتی کارکن پیدا کرنے اور قدر نکالنے کے بارے میں زیادہ پر مبنی ہے۔ اور میرا خیال ہے کہ جیسا کہ ہم جانتے تھے کہ نیٹ ورکنگ بڑے پیمانے پر تیار ہوا ہے ، آپ جانتے ہو ، میں اس خیال کو کس طرح نکال سکتا ہوں یا آپ جانتے ہو کہ اپنے خرچ پر میرا کاروبار بہتر جگہ پر حاصل کرسکتا ہے۔ اور مجھے لگتا ہے کہ اب ہم ایک ایسے دور میں جا رہے ہیں جہاں ہر چیز کو قدر کا ایک ذریعہ بننے اور جیت کی تمثیلیں بنانے میں گریز کیا جانا چاہئے۔ اور میرا خیال ہے کہ جب بھی آپ کوئی چیز بنا رہے ہو تو ، آپ لوگوں کی انفرادی مفاد کو اپنی روشن خیالی سے ایک طرح سے ترتیب دے سکتے ہیں جس سے جیت کا آغاز ہوتا ہے ، میرے خیال میں یہ سب سے بڑا راز ہے ، اگر آپ کر سکتے ہو ان کے دلوں کو چھونے اور اس کی بات کرنے کا ایک طریقہ تلاش کریں جس کی وہ گہری فکر کرتے ہیں اور اسی وقت ان کے وژن کو اس انداز میں آگے بڑھائیں جو جیت ہے ، ہار نہیں بلکہ جیتنا ہے ، میرے خیال میں یہ غیر معمولی نظارے بنانے اور اپنے آپ کو سیدھ میں رکھنے کی ترکیب ہے۔ صحیح لوگوں کے ساتھ

کیٹی: مجھے یہ پسند ہے۔ اور میں ضرور مانتا ہوں۔ ابھی میرا ایک جذبہ تعلیم میں ہونے والی تبدیلی سے نمٹنے میں ہے۔ اور میں ایک بہت بڑا مومن ہوں کہ اکثر آپ اندر سے نظام کو تبدیل نہیں کرسکتے ہیں۔ کبھی کبھی آپ کو کچھ اور تیار کرنا ہوتا ہے جو باہر سے بہتر ہو۔ اور اس لئے میں اس کے آس پاس کے ایک ایسے سسٹم پر کام کر رہا ہوں ، جو ہمارے بچوں کے اسکول کی عمر تک پہنچنے کے اپنے خیال پر تیار ہوا ، یہ احساس کرتے ہوئے کہ ہمارے پاس موجود آپشنز میں سے کوئی بھی دستیاب نہیں ہے۔ ذہن میں ، بالغ زندگی میں ان کا سامنا کرنا پڑ سکتا ہے جو کچھ بھی کے لئے بالکل تیار ہے. اور اس طرح ہم نے 80/20 نقطہ نظر کو استعمال کیا اور یہ سمجھا کہ ایک متغیر جو موجود ہے اس میں سے کسی کو بھی جاری رکھنا نہیں ہے ، اور ایک ایسا پروگرام بنایا ہے جس میں بڑی تعداد میں کاروبار اور مسئلہ حل کرنے پر توجہ دی جارہی ہے ، دوسرے خاندانوں کے ساتھ اشتراک کرنے کے لئے بہت پرجوش. لیکن میں اس طرح کی اقدار کو سیدھ میں لانے کے خیال میں آپ کے ساتھ پوری طرح اتفاق کرتا ہوں۔ اور مجھے یہ بھی پسند ہے کہ آپ نے داخلی حالت کو آگے بڑھایا ہے اور اس کے اندرونی کام کر رہے ہیں کیونکہ مجھے لگتا ہے کہ یہ ایسی چیز ہے جس کے بارے میں زیادہ سے زیادہ بات کی جارہی ہے ، اور یہ بھی میرے سفر کا ایک بہت بڑا حصہ تھا۔ میں جانتا ہوں کہ اگر آپ کے پاس اس سے متعلق کوئی ذاتی کہانی یا وسائل ہیں کیونکہ میرے اپنے نقطہ نظر سے ، میں نے تقریبا a ایک دہائی تک تمام جسمانی صحت اور تندرستی سے متعلق حیاتیات کی چیزیں کیں اور کچھ ترقی کی ، لیکن اتنا زیادہ نہیں جتنا میں نے امید کی تھی . اور یہ تب تک نہیں تھا جب تک میں نے اندرونی کام نہیں کیا تھا ، کہ سب کچھ ڈرامائی انداز میں بدل گیا تھا۔ اور اب میں اس کے لئے بہت زیادہ وکیل ہوں۔ مجھے تجسس ہے اگر آپ کے پاس کوئی وسائل ہیں جس کی آپ سفارش کرتے ہیں یا اس سے متعلق کوئی ذاتی کہانی۔

مائیکل: ہاں ، آپ کا شکریہ۔ یہ ایک خوبصورت سوال ہے۔ میں جانتا ہوں ، جتنا ہم میں سے بہت سارے لوگوں کے پاس ہے ، آپ جانتے ہو ، واقعی آزمائش اور غلطی کا عمل جاری رہا ہے۔ لہذا میں نے بہت سارے تجربات کیے ہیں اور میں نے آپ کو معلوم ہے کہ اس تاریخی فورم کو MITT کہا جاتا ہے ، جو ایک ایسا ہی پروگرام ہے۔ مجھے شوق ہے کہ میں ہاف مین عمل کو آزماؤں۔ میرے پاس ، آپ جانتے ہو ، مردوں کے کاموں میں دل کی گہرائیوں سے دلچسپی لیتے ہیں۔ میں نے اپنے والد کے ساتھ اتنے قریبی تعلقات استوار کرنے کی ایک وجہ ، میں نے منک کنڈ پروجیکٹ نامی کچھ کیا ، جس سے مجھے معلوم ہے کہ آپ کے سامعین میں ماں کی ایک بڑی تعداد ہے۔ آپ جانتے ہو کہ ، جن لوگوں کو ہم پسند کرتے ہیں ان کے لئے تجویز کردہ تبدیلی کرنا ہمیشہ مشکل ہے۔ لیکن ایک سب سے بڑا کام جو میں نے کیا ہے وہ وہ ہے منک کنڈ پروجیکٹ کیونکہ میں سمجھتا ہوں ، تم جانتے ہو ، مردوں کے لئے اور ان خواتین سے جو ان سے پیار کرتے ہیں ، آپ جانتے ہو ، بدقسمتی سے ، اس دن اور عمر میں ایسا نہیں ہے ، انفرادیت کا زبردست عمل ، ٹھیک ہے؟ لہذا ، ہم اب صحت کی نقل و حرکت میں دیکھتے ہیں ، بہت سارے ، آپ جانتے ہیں ، مجھے یقین ہے کہ لوگوں نے جو شو میں دکھایا تھا ، اس بات پر بحث کرنے کی طرح ہیں کہ آپ اعلٰی حیات یا ابتدائی کھانے کو کہتے ہیں ، ٹھیک ہے؟ ، جیسے ، کے تصور کی طرح ، ہم کس طرح واپس جائیں گے کہ انسانی حیاتیات کا ارتقا کیسے ہوا؟ ٹھیک ہے ، میرے خیال میں ایک ایسا راستہ بھی ہے جس میں انسانی نفسیات اور انسانی برادری تیار ہوئی ہے۔ اور بدقسمتی سے ، جدید دور کی زندگی لازمی طور پر ایسی نظر نہیں آتی ہے ، آپ جانتے ہیں۔ آپ جانتے ہو کہ سینکڑوں سال پہلے بالی کی ایک ماں ، اکثر دیسی ثقافتوں میں اکثر بچے پیدا کرتی ہوگی ، آپ جانتے ہو ، یہ بچہ ہر دودھ پلانے والی ماں کی چھاتی کے ساتھ گزر جاتا تھا۔ اب ، ہم جان چکے ہیں کہ شاید یہ نہ صرف مائکرو بایوم میں اضافہ کرے گا ، بلکہ یہ ایک معاشرتی رشتہ بھی پیدا کرتا ہے ، اور اس خیال سے بچے کو پالنے میں ایک گاؤں بھی پڑتا ہے۔

اور مجھے لگتا ہے کہ معاشرے کا یہ تصور اتنا طاقتور ہے۔ اور مردوں کے ساتھ ، آپ کو معلوم ہے کہ ، انفرادیت کے روایتی عمل تھے ، جہاں آپ جانتے ہو ، ایک نوجوان یا نوعمر آدمی کو بزرگوں کے گروہ ، معاشرے میں مردوں کے گروہ کے ذریعہ لے جایا جاتا تھا اور در حقیقت وہ اکثر اوقات ایک مشکل رسوم سے گزرتا ہے۔ یا چیلینجنگ عمل کو اب ایک مرد کی حیثیت سے تعی .ن کرنا۔ اور یہ وہی دکھائی دیتا ہے جو معاشرے میں کارآمد شراکت دار بنتا ہے۔ اور بہت سارے فلسفیانہ ہونے کے بغیر ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ اب ہم دنیا میں نادانی مذکر کی بہت سی مثالوں کو دیکھتے ہیں۔ اور خوش قسمتی سے ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ ہم ان حیرت انگیز طور پر طاقتور خواتین کی ایک بہت بڑی بلندی اور حب الوطنی کے نظام کی طرح نسائی نسواں میں بھی اضافہ دیکھ رہے ہیں۔ لیکن بہت زیادہ دور نہ ہونے کے بطور ، میں سمجھتا ہوں کہ مین کنڈ پروجیکٹ میرے لئے اتنا گہرا تھا کیونکہ اس نے واقعتا men مجھے مفت کنٹینر میں ہفتہ وار بنیاد پر مردوں کے گروپ کی مدد حاصل کرنے کے قابل بنا دیا ، جہاں ہم گہرے کام کرسکتے ہیں جس نے مجھے قابل بنایا اور مجھے لگتا ہے کہ جن مردوں کے ساتھ میں نے اس جگہ کا اشتراک کیا وہ خود کا سب سے موثر ورژن بنیں ، اور اپنے شراکت داروں کو بہتر طریقے سے دکھائیں۔ آپ جانتے ہو ، ان میں سے بہت سے مردوں کے لئے جن کے بچے تھے اپنے بچوں کو بہتر طریقے سے دکھاتے تھے۔ اور خدمت کی جگہ سے اور اپنے آپ سے بھی بڑی چیز کے لئے کھڑے ہونے کے عزم کی جگہ سے۔ اور اس طرح ، میرے لئے ، بہت سارے اوزار موجود ہیں ، آپ جانتے ہو ، کچھ بہت گہرے دیسی بزرگوں کے ساتھ دوائیں لگائیں۔ مجھے یہ کہنا خاصا مخصوص ہے کہ میں سمجھتا ہوں کہ اس طرح کے جدید ٹولز پر عمل کرنا چاہئے ، ظاہر ہے کہ صحیح ڈبے اور صحیح تناظر میں۔ لیکن ، آپ جانتے ہو ، میں اپنی زندگی بھر کی بھر پور کوشش کرنے کی زندگی بھر کی وابستگی رکھتا ہوں ، اور میں ہمیشہ ایسے ٹولز کی تلاش میں رہتا ہوں جو اس کو قابل بنائے۔ اور ظاہر ہے کہ ہم آپ کے بارے میں بات کرسکتے ہیں ، اور آپ کو مختلف ٹولوں پر ماتمی لباس میں شامل کر سکتے ہیں جو مددگار ثابت ہوئے ہیں۔

لیکن میرے خیال میں ، ایک عام اصول کے طور پر ، میرے نزدیک ، مردوں کا کام واقعی لازمی رہا ہے۔ اور میں واقعی میں پرجوش ہوں اور میں انکوائری کے بارے میں ہوں ، اصل میں ، جس کے بارے میں میں نے کسی سے بات نہیں کی ہے ، لیکن جیسے کہ میں اب واقعی جا رہا ہوں اور باپ دادا سے انٹرویو لے رہا ہوں ، کیونکہ میرے والد نے حال ہی میں اپریل میں انتقال کیا تھا ، اور وہ میری زندگی میں ایک ایسی معنی خیز شخصیت تھے۔ اور جب میں یہاں آئندہ چند سالوں میں باپ بننے کی امید کے مرحلے میں داخل ہوں گا تو ، میں واقعتا successful کامیاب مردوں سے انٹرویو لینے کا شوقین ہوں کہ یہ معلوم کریں کہ وہ کس طرح کامیابی کے روایتی یا روایتی نظریات کے ذریعے تشریف لے گئے ، اور پھر وہ بھی موجود ہوسکتے ہیں۔ ایک عظیم باپ بننے کے لئے تیار. اور میں جانتا ہوں کہ آپ کے سامعین میں آپ کی بہت ساری ناقابل یقین والدہ ہیں اور شاید کچھ بڑے باپ بھی۔ لہذا یہ انکوائری جو میں ابھی کر رہا ہوں وہ یہ ہے کہ ہم جدید معاشرے میں واقعی اپنی زندگی کے مختلف ابواب کے ذریعہ واقعی ایک خوبصورت انداز میں کیسے آگے بڑھتے ہیں ، تاکہ ہم ان لوگوں کے لئے سب سے بڑا ذریعہ اور شراکت بن سکتے ہیں جن سے ہم محبت کرتے ہیں۔ اور اس طرح ، آپ جانتے ہو ، یہ وہی ٹولز ہیں جو میں نے استعمال کیے ہیں۔ میں کسی بھی طرح سے نہیں ہوں گا ، کہو کہ میں لازمی طور پر ایک اتھارٹی ہوں ، لیکن وہ میرے ہی ارتقا میں بہت ، بہت مددگار ثابت ہوئے ہیں۔ اور میں نے دیکھا ہے کہ وہ دوسروں کی زندگی میں غیر معمولی مددگار ثابت ہوتے ہیں۔

کیٹی: ٹھیک ہے ، سب سے پہلے ، مجھے آپ کے نقصان پر بہت افسوس ہے۔ میں نے ابھی تک والدین کو نہیں کھویا ہے ، لیکن میں صرف تصور کرسکتا ہوں۔ یہ ایک بہت ہی مشکل نقصان ہے۔

مائیکل: شکریہ۔

کیٹی: میں نے اس گروپ کے بارے میں نہیں سنا تھا ، لیکن معاشرے کی ضرورت ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ آپ بالکل ٹھیک ہیں ، کہ یہ ایسی بات ہے جو شاید خواتین کے لئے قدرتی طور پر تھوڑی بہت زیادہ ہوجاتی ہے یا کم از کم مجھے اپنی زندگی میں یہ نظر آتا ہے اور دوستوں میں ، کیونکہ خواتین زیادہ تر ماما گروپس یا لڑکیاں راتوں کو پیدا کرتی ہیں یا جو کچھ بھی ہو سکتا ہے پیدا کرنے کی طرف مائل رہتی ہیں اور اگر وہ قدرتی طور پر واقع نہیں ہوتیں تو کمیونٹیز تشکیل دیتی ہیں۔ اور ایسا لگتا ہے کہ یہ لڑکوں کے لئے شاید ایک مشکل چیز ہے یا کم سے کم میں صرف اتنی آسانی سے اور اکثر ہوتا ہوا نہیں دیکھ رہا ہوں۔ اور جیسا کہ آپ نے پہلے ذکر کیا ہے ، ہم کلینیکل ڈیٹا سے بھی جانتے ہیں ، کہ معاشرے اور تعلقات نہ صرف ہماری ذہنی حالت کے لئے ، بلکہ ہماری حقیقی جسمانی صحت کے لئے بھی اتنے اہم ہیں۔ اور مجھے لگتا ہے کہ یہ ایسی چیز ہے جو آج کی دنیا میں بہت مشکل ہے۔ جیسے ، بہت سارے عوامل ہیں جو ان واقعی میں ٹھوس تعلقات اور واقعی عظیم برادریوں کی تشکیل کو مشکل تر بناتے ہیں۔ اور یہ وہ چیز ہے جو ہمیں آج کی دنیا میں زیادہ جان بوجھ کر بنانا ہے۔ اور یوں لگتا ہے کہ یہ ایک بہت اچھا ٹول ہے جس کے ل many بہت سارے سامعین اپنے شراکت داروں یا شوہروں کو بطور وسیلہ بھیج سکتے ہیں۔ معاشرے کی تعمیر کے ل Any کوئی دوسرا اشارے کیونکہ یہ وہی چیز ہے جس کے بارے میں میں نے اس پوڈ کاسٹ پر درحقیقت بہت زیادہ بات کی ہے۔ اور مجھے سامعین سے ابھی بھی بہت سارے سوالات درپیش ہیں کہ آپ واقعتا عملی طور پر یہ کیسے کرتے ہیں ، خاص طور پر اگر یہ ایسی چیز نہیں ہے جس میں آپ اپنی رہائش پذیر ہیں۔

مائیکل: ہاں ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ آپ نے وہاں پر پوری طرح مارا ، کیٹی۔ میرا مطلب ہے ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ بالکل ٹھیک ہے۔ لہذا ہارورڈ کی اپنی نوعیت کے طویل ترین طولانی مطالعے نے ایک واحد سب سے بڑی صعوبت کا ثبوت دیا ، جس کا میں نے تھوڑا سا پہلے حوالہ کیا ، جو ہماری طویل مدتی صحت اور خوشی کا واحد واحد سب سے بڑا منطقی نتیجہ ہے۔ واحد لمبا سب سے طویل المیعاد تعلقات کا معیار ہے۔ اب ، اس مطالعے کو کسی طرح سے خام کردیا گیا تھا کیونکہ انھوں نے صرف مردوں کو ہی ٹریک کیا تھا۔ تو میں امید کر رہا ہوں کہ ، آپ کو معلوم ہے کہ ، اس کے بعد بھی بہت سے مزید مطالعے ہونے ہیں لیکن مجھے لگتا ہے کہ معلومات کی بنیاد درست ہے ، ٹھیک ہے؟ میرے خیال میں کمیونٹی ، جو ہمارے وقت کا سب سے بڑا چیلنج ہے کیونکہ ہم ایسے انفرادی مرکوز معاشرے میں رہتے ہیں ، کم از کم سننے والوں میں بہت سے لوگ دوا ہیں۔ اور میرے خیال میں مختلف طریقوں سے آپ معاشرے کو تشکیل دے سکتے ہیں۔ یہ دراصل اس کتاب کا عنوان ہے جو میں فی الحال لکھ رہا ہوں۔ لہذا یہ وہ چیز ہے جس کی مجھے گہری فکر ہے۔ لیکن بڑے پیمانے پر ، آپ جانتے ہیں ، مجھے لگتا ہے کہ ہمیں اپنے آباؤ اجداد کی طرف کچھ طریقوں سے دیکھنے کی ضرورت ہے اور اس کے بارے میں سوچنے کی ضرورت ہے کہ وہ کمیونٹی کی تعمیر کے لئے کون سے طریقہ کار استعمال کرتے ہیں۔ You know, we had a sacred ritual in my family that I thank my mother for every day, which is that, you know, when we had dinner at 6:00 pm, every night, the whole family was there. You know, no phones, no television, and we had that chance to sort of bond as a family. And, you know, around every holiday, around, you know, on weekends, we would extend that out into our community, and to our neighbors, you know, have a barbecue, etc. And I think, you know, there are various modern kind of cultural events, like sporting events, you know, obviously, dinner parties, these are all, you know, opportunities I think to forge community. But I think we also have these modern tools, you know. I mean, you have this incredible podcast. I can say that, since I’ve started my podcast, I’ve developed incredible relationships, as well with some of my guests, and have been invited into incredible opportunities.

So there’s an example of a digital platform, that’s actually a very modern-day platform that’s led to some really beautiful community and invitation to some incredible events. So, I actually have so much to say about the topic. I’ll try to be, you know, a little bit concise. But in essence, I think it’s thinking about really mindful, you know. You know, there’s this notion of something called social capital. And I think it’s a flawed term. But in essence, it’s thinking about how you invest in your relationships and which relationships give the greatest return? And I think all of us in life have encountered people that traditionally we look at as, you know, there’ll be denoted as either a giver and a taker, right? Some people in our lives seem to always take without giving. I call those people black holes. You know, and then certain people are batteries in our life. You know, they give us juice. They give us life. They give us vitality. They give without expectation of return. And I think ultimately, that’s how we wanna show up as a catalyst and as a node for community is being a giver, and being a source of value, and connecting. You know, one of my practices in my morning routine is actually to send a voice notes to different people, or a thank you note, handwritten in the mail, to let people know how much I care about them. No expectation. No ask. Nothing but it’s simply an offering. And, you know, offerings have been using communities and cultures since time immemorial as a way to pay reverence and be in a place of gratitude, which we also now has the corollaries to our state of happiness. So, I think basically, we want to find a way to be a battery to those around us. We wanna surround ourselves consciously. And this is what my book’s about. It’s how to consciously create your relationships. I think many of us kind of fall into default patterns. But I think you can, just as you would, your finances really look at who’s showing up as a battery in my life, where are their black holes?

You know, our most valuable resource on planet is our time and, you know, the health with which we have to live that time with people we love, you know, with our relationships. That’s the true currency in life to me. And so, you know, I think there’s a various… I have actually seven principles, but basically, ways in which you can cultivate consciously the kind of relationships, the kind of community that will have the greatest corollary, and hopefully your life, and your long-term health and happiness. And, you know, depending on what you value… For me, at least I know, you know, having looked at death, lately with the man I loved the most on the planet, my father, is really thinking about your legacy. And his great legacy lives on in me and that he was such a battery in my life, the way he showed up for me, the way he both balanced business and showed up to, you know, all my sporting events, and was always present when I needed him. You know, I think mothers are so great at that. I think some of us as men get to catch up to you all in terms of your level of service and the degree to which you are batteries in the lives of your children. But in essence, I think, to me, there’s a great passion around how do we consciously co-create with other batteries in our life? And to me, you know, I have a lot to say about that. But in essence, I think there’s few greater exercises because I know at least for me on my deathbed, I will look back and think, you know… I don’t care if I have a Lamborghini in the driveway. I don’t need an eight-bedroom house, but I will have lived a valuable life if I have been a source for those I cared deeply about and have had quality experiences shared with those I love. And to me, that’s a life worth living.

Katie: I am very much in line with you on that. And to echo what you said as well, I believe you’re absolutely right. I’ve said for a long time that I think mothers are one of the most powerful forces on the planet, not just because we have such a daily impact on the next generation, but I think a mother’s tone often sets the tone for the whole household and for their children’s inner voice later in life. And so it’s been an absolute honor to be able to be part of this community of moms who I think have such a tremendous ability to impact outcomes on a world scale. Absolutely. I also love that you brought up those inner points and I wanna touch on your morning routine in a minute. But a modern thinker, I really admire Naval Ravikant, he says, that, “Basically, no matter what level of wealth you create, there’s three things that seem to be actually most aligned with happiness.” And the beauty of these things are it doesn’t matter if you are, to use your earlier example, Bill Gates, you can’t just buy them. You have to actually do the work. And that is a calm mind of the body and a happy home, and the happy home, of course, to the relationship side. But those are things that doesn’t matter how much material or success you have on paper, you have to actually put the time and effort into building, and curating, and creating, and maintaining, which to your point, I think those are some great tips for doing so. And you mentioned your morning routine. Anytime someone is successful, especially on such a large scale, I’m always curious what their morning routine looks like. So what is your morning like?

Michael: Yeah, well, my morning looks… It depends on… Right now I’m traveling, as I mentioned, I’m in Jackson Hole. So there’s sort of a broken-down aspect of the process. But generally, when I’m home, my morning routine looks like waking up. You know, when I’m really good. I like to wake up before the sunrise. That happens less frequently than I would like. But in ideal in an ideal world, I’d like to really move with the circadian rhythms, you know, the movement of the sun. I think it’s one of the great under spoken about elements of health and wellness. And the more days I can watch the sunrise and the sunset, the better. And generally speaking, my process starts with gratitude. So, really, when I first wake up thinking about two or three things that I’m grateful for, right, to set that sort of mindset up in a good way. You know, the second thing I do is I meditate. So I’ve done a variety of different meditation practices. I studied Vipassana when I lived in Srilanka. I’ve also done Vedic Meditation, which is incredible, which uses sound as an anchor for your meditation practice. And I’ve kind of created my own mindfulness practice. But usually, I’ll set Insight Timer, which is, you know, it’s an app on my phone for 10 minutes because I know, just like your audience. You know, a lot of busy moms, a lot of times don’t have the luxury of a ton of time. That said, I think the great hack for busy moms and busy parents is how much we can create time for ourselves in the morning, you know, in the case of your audience and perhaps, you know, before their kids wake up. And so, for me, you know, it’s gratitude. It’s meditation. I don’t do this every morning, I’d love to say I did. But I like to do the morning pages. You know, Julia Cameron wrote that great book, “The Artist’s Way.”

And if you can create time, I think even just to write one page in your journal, even if it’s a nonsense, I think that act of writing is so powerful, that act of reflection. It’s also… As I think about, you know, if I ever had to leave the house, the first things I would grab in a hurry would be my journals. So, journaling is a part. I do hydration. So I think, you know, a glass of water, ideally, with some kind of, like, minerals. So, like, some type of hydrating minerals or even like an Irish or a Celtic salt. And then I do do coffee. You know, various people feel various ways about coffee. I’m a huge fan of coffee. And of late, I’ve actually been practicing intermittent fasting. So I’ll do black coffee, so it’s not to break my fast. And I generally do an eight-hour feeding window. So I’ll go from 12:00 to 8:00 pm. And then, you know, and I’m not like hardcore about it. By the way, I also believe in joy. I don’t believe in beating yourself up. I don’t think you need to, like, be hard on yourself, all of us. You know, it’s like I’m at a party and I wanna have some birthday cake, I’m gonna have a birthday cake. So I think life is also about joy. But in general, those are the precepts is I try not to at least during the week. You know, I’ll do black coffee until about noon. But that’s usually… And then I’ll sort of reflect, and ground myself, and take a few deep breaths, and think about what I want to achieve that day. And that’s kind of the core tenants. There are other aspects. You know, I live by the ocean. I’m fortunate to live by the ocean. So, in an ideal world, and what I was doing for quite a long time is I would get a workout in first thing in the morning. You know, a lot of my research shows that, you know, the most accomplished CEOs, you know, the President and Michelle Obama to, you know, Oprah Winfrey on down, would do exercise in the morning.

And I do exercise in the morning and then when I’m really good, if I’m home, I’ll jump in the ocean and get that cold plunge in because nothing wakes you up more effectively, that a little Wim Hof breathing into the cold. It could either a cold shower or the ocean. So, that’s in essence my routine. And I just wanted to… Just because it was on your last point, it’s a little bit of a non sequitur, but to relate to what you said about moms, which is I was just listening to Melinda Gates yesterday. And she reiterated something I think really powerfully about, which is, in the context of Global Citizen, when you look at the qualities of what has the most profound potential to change the world. The most profound potential to change the world is actually the empowerment of women and moms around the world. Because moms inherently I feel like have the mindset and as well as the practices and behaviors to be a catalyst, again, to bring a sort of full circle, to be a battery, not just for themselves, but for their family and for their communities. And so as you see it with the Grameen Bank, and with a variety of different, you know, Jacqueline Novogratz in the Acumen Fund, if you empower women and girls around the world, it will have the greatest corollary on our chance of hopefully righting this shift in such a way that we can live on this planet for many, many years to come. So, I just wanted to say that because you had mentioned the power of moms, and actually research has shown that the greatest investment we can make is in the future of women and girls on this planet.

Katie: Awesome. And I think that that’s also a perfect segue talking about your morning routine into another question that I had for you. So my husband met you before I did. And he said you guys had an amazing conversation about all kinds of different biohacking tools and practices that you’ve tried. And I’m really curious, what you would consider the top needle movers with everything that you’ve tried, if you had to kind of 80/20 all of the things out there, what would make the cut for you?

Michael: Yeah, great question. For me, contrast therapy is my kind of current fascination. So, for those listening, moving from, you know, high heat to cold, cold, and doing breathwork in the midst of that process. So, you know, I’m grateful to have a sauna. But, you know, I’m always mindful of, you know, not everyone has all these tools. I think that said, I think if you can find a way to move from the heat, and there’s various ways to do that, that are very economical to cold. And that can look and often looks like for me a cold shower. You know, sometimes it’s going into a hot yoga class into a cold shower. Sometimes, you know, it’s going from a sauna into, you know, a cold tub with ice and doing breathwork. You know, I could go into the myriad of benefits, but the benefits are profound in terms of, you know, reducing inflammation. I think the mindset benefits are profound. So, contrast therapy is one of mine. I did a whole podcast on it if people wanna go super deep. But contrast therapy is one of my current, you know, fascinations. I would say breath is one of the most underrated and also most accessible biohacks that any of us can utilize. So from holotropic breathwork to tantric breathing, you know, I think our breath has the opportunity to unlock worlds that we are only coming to fully realize. You know, the Tibetans knew that with tummo breathing, which is the basis for, you know, now we see Wim Hof. I did an interview with Laird Hamilton, the world-class big wave surfer around breathing. And many of them are getting there. Their insights from this ancient Tibetan secret practice, traditionally secret practice called tummo breathing. But I think that breathwork has the possibility to unlock huge health and cognitive benefits that all of us have access to. You don’t need to buy any expensive equipment.

It’s a truly expansive and unlimited frontier in regards to the way that we can use our breath together with a mindfulness practice. The other biohacks that I’m playing with up late really is this notion of circadian living and fasting. There’s a great talk, I can’t remember, if you just Google TED talk on circadian biology, I’m trying to remember the name of who I listened to, but in essence, you know, some argue that, that when we eat is almost as important as what we eat. And, you know, I think we’ve oftentimes gotten out of sync with, again, this goes to ancestral biology. But, like, traditionally hunter-gatherers, you know, would go from feast to famine in some regards in terms of their eating cycles. And so, for me, I think the idea of fasting and its potential to increase health benefits for me, that’s largely intermittent fasting. You know, I did a podcast with Dr. Stephen Cabral. He advocates for a weekly also, like from Sunday night to Monday night doing, like, a weekly fast through that day. Obviously you wanna check with your healthcare provider. You know, I’m not a medical practitioner. And then he does a quarterly sort of week-long, cleanse fast, which isn’t a dry fast. But, you know, we’re seeing now the benefits of fasting are profound. And, you know, in terms of autophagy and, like, all of the different elements that it can bring in terms of, like, cellular regeneration and sort of the resets that we can create. And so for me, I’m really looking at also getting sun and as much as possible, you know, being in rhythm with the natural cycles. So, during the day, that looks like, you know, trying to eliminate and, you know, probably many of your listeners already do this, but, like, eliminating blue light after dark. So I try to watch the sunset if I can. I try to do some sun gazing, get that 10 minutes of sun, get that vitamin D.

Also huge right now for our immunity. You know, vitamin C, vitamin D, elderberry, as we’re amidst, sort of coronavirus that prevents it, but just in terms of bolstering our immunity and really thinking about how to move through the day in a way that enables us with what we now know is one of the core tenants of our health and wellness, which is great quality sleep. And so, for me using candles at night, using blue light blocking glasses if I’m using my device, watching the sunset, and just establishing a little bit more of that natural rhythm. And all that kind of boils down to the greatest biohack, for me, if you will. And when I interviewed Ben Greenfield, he said the same thing. If you were to distill all that down, well, with the one thing be? And for me, it’s getting into nature. So to me, I’m just trying to approximate the natural rhythms of our ancestors in modern life. And, you know, use some of the great tools and hacks that have been prevalent for millennia, and try to approximate them in modern living. And so, for me, you know, my favorite thing in the world if I can find a hot spring, next to a cold Creek, I’m in heaven because that’s the ultimate contrast therapy because I’m also taking in the fresh air, the nature, the splendor of just being alive in this life, which I think gratitude is one of the greatest corollaries to living well. So, nature brings me back to where I need to be. And that’s my ultimate biohack.

Katie: I love that you brought up the idea of circadian living. And I will make sure that Ted Talk is linked in the show notes as well. But I think this is one of those relatively free things to implement that’s so overlooked, and there are great researchers like Sachin Panda who talk about, but just the idea of restricting the things that signal awake and asleep to the right times. So in other words, in nature, to your point, we would only encounter certain spectrums of light when the sun was out. So, trying to keep those bedrooms light to the hours when we would normally encounter them. We would also only be eating during certain hours. So trying to eat as a general rule when the sun’s up and not eat when the sun’s not up. And then beyond that, like you said, you can shorten that window to experiment with that thing I’ve found benefit from as well. But the beauty of that is it doesn’t cost anything. You’re just moving around the times, you’re already doing these things. And you can see significant benefits from doing that.

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Talk a little bit more about contrast therapy and how this can be implemented. I think from what I’ve researched, there seem to be almost distinct benefits from the different extremes on their own and then also together. So in other words, they were really well-documented benefits of heat in the form of sauna or whatever it may be. Also benefits of cold on its own. And then when you combine them in the form of contrast therapy, it almost comes with a whole separate host of benefits.

Michael: Yeah, that’s exactly right. So I did a whole podcast on this on my show, which is just “Peak Mind” with Michael Trainer on contrast therapy, but in essence, sort of short-form version, you said it perfectly. So, you know, heat brings its own benefit. You know, there’s sort of the biological as well as sort of the psychological benefits that come with both heat and cold. So, you know, cold has been used, you know, by athletes for ages, right, to prevent injury, to reduce inflammation. It basically is a constrictor, so you get that vaso constriction, right? And so when you combine that, for example, with heat, you’re moving… And obviously, this has actually been practiced in certain cultures for ages, right? In Russia, in Scandinavia, these had been practices in some of the longest, you’re talking about longevity, you know, and some of the longest living populations. But you move into the heat and, you know, you’re getting the detoxification effects, right? So, for example, I personally have been exposed to mold and many of us have, right? Like, there’s estimations that 50% of the buildings in the U.S. could be moldy, right? So, there’s environmental toxins, which I think, unfortunately, is now a corollary to modern day living. You know, even children that are unborn are exposed now to chemicals, beyond anything we had previously reckoned with. So the idea of creating detoxification pathways is so central and so elemental, I think, to modern-day life and living. And the sauna is one of the greatest ways to use you know, your skin basically and your sweat to excrete many of those stored toxins. You know, so I’m about to do a heavy metal test. But I’ve done everything from… I used a lab called vibrant labs. I did a cardiac test. I’ve done a gut health test in terms of testing my microbiome. I’ve done, you know, cognitive test.

I’ve tested my mitochondrial health in terms of my cellular abilities. And I’m now using heart rate variability. We now all have access to, like, tools like Oura ring, or the Biostrap, or the Whoop band, and start to train sort of our heart rate. But the other benefit of heat obviously, is you start to get your heart pumping, you start to sweat, you’re removing toxins, and then you move into cold, and then you create that constriction, right? So you’re kind of just like the breath or waves in the ocean. You know, you’re creating that contraction and expansion, and both bring profound benefits. The other thing is you’re creating resilience, right? So, like, both in a biological but also in a psychological state. No one that I know of wants to jump into a cold plunge. I mean, there probably are… I’m sure there are people that are sort of masochistic that love getting into a cold bath. I do not love getting in, but I love the feeling of getting out, right? Because, in essence, you know, I know that I’ve reduced inflammation. Inflammation is the source of many of our inflammatory diseases, right? Like, talk about the developing versus the developed world. You know, diseases… You know, like dementia is a disease largely of the developed world. I mean, these are inflammatory diseases. Some people are looking at this, calling it type 3 diabetes. You know, we now have, unfortunately, more obese people on the planet that non-obese people. You know, this is a whole nother podcast. But, you know, we don’t have access to the same nutritious soil. A lot of people live in food deserts.

So the degree to ensure that we can reduce inflammation, given how much obviously that food, comes through nutrition and using healthy oils, and all the different things we could talk about. But I think the other piece is the tools that we can use that are anti-inflammatory in contrast, therapy is incredible in terms of reducing inflammation. Those are all to our benefit, right? Because it sets us up… You know, there’s germ in the terrain theory, and we’re all now exposed to more germs, more toxins. So the more that we can take care of our terrain, our home turf, the better. And I love contrast theory for it’s anti-inflammatory properties. I love the idea of excreting toxins. I love the degree of creating sort of blood flow, that contraction, that expansion, the oxygenation of the blood, that I think is profoundly helpful. So, I could go on and on. But in essence, I think contrast therapy using heat and cold, and you can do that in nature is one of the best things you can do for your health.

Katie: Another topic I’d love to touch on if you’re willing. I know you mentioned your dad and the dementia side of things. And I know this is an area where we’re doing a lot more research right now. And I’ve heard it in the research referred to even is like type 3 diabetes. And there’s, like, a metabolic component there… I’m sure you’ve done a lot of research in this area, because it was so close to home for you, that I feel like that’s something we’re seeing an increase in. Do you have anything that you’ve come across in your research that people can do preemptively at younger ages, that we can do in our own families to help protect against that?

Michael: Yeah, so I think, unfortunately, and having had deep personal experience with this with my father, who I love dearly, I would not wish cognitive decline on anyone. It’s one of the most devastating conditions. I feel for any of your audience members that are experiencing cognitive decline or have a family member with dementia or Alzheimer’s. You know, symptoms start, they say, and the onset is 30 years before the first symptom, right? So, all of us listening, you know, if you’re 35, 40 years old on up, it’s beneficial to start thinking about bolstering your resources sort of say internally, so as to mitigate against the risk. Now, there are certain biological and genetic markers that do have corollaries to onset of Alzheimer’s, something called the APOE4, which is gene. You get one from your mother, one from your father. If you have one APOE4 allele, you’re three times more likely to get Alzheimer’s. If you have two APOE4 allele, you’re somewhere closer to nine times more likely to get Alzheimer’s. So, there is a genetic element. However, what I’ll say is, even if you have and forgive the analogy, a loaded gun, genetically, that doesn’t mean that you ever have to pull the trigger. So epigenetics, in other words, diet and lifestyle are our greatest defense against cognitive decline. And I’m not a doctor, I have done a tremendous amount of research on this. And I’ve gone into it pretty deeply on my show. But I will say Dale Bredesen has written an amazing book called “The End of Alzheimer’s.” He correlates, you know, the causation with sort of your roof. And it’s not one thing but it’s many holes in your roof. For example, you know, environmental toxins, how heavy is your load in terms of environmental toxicity? What are your genetics? What’s your diet and lifestyle like? Are you consuming inflammatory oils you know?

You know, ideally, you wanna stick to, you know, not a lot of the dirty oils that are used, you know, in a lot of conventional cooking, right? Sticking more to like your olive oils, and your coconut oils, and your avocado oils. So oils can be inflammatory. You know, foods obviously… And I’m sure you’ve done a ton of these shows, Katie, but, you know, basically moving away from anything that promotes inflammation in the system, what crosses… You know, just like you can have leaky gut, you can have leaky brain. So if you’re not… You know, your gut is also your enteric nervous system. It’s your second brain. You know, I’m sure you’ve done a great number of shows on gut health. But maintaining great health with your gut… My father unfortunately, had a wheat allergy and had celiac. He didn’t know that until later in life. You know, much now of our grains and our gluten have glyphosate, you know, the Monsanto sort of pesticide, which can wreak havoc on our guts. So, this is obviously a huge topic. But if I were to point to a couple of resources just in the time we have, Dale Bredesen’s book is amazing. Dr. Mark Hyman’s work is amazing, in terms… He does a series called “The Broken Brain,” which I highly recommend. I’ve done several podcasts with Dr. Terry Wahls. I’m about to do one with Dr. Bredesen, Dr. Mark Hyman, probably folks that you’ve had also on your show but in essence, you know, really seeking out the best functional medicine doctors. But I think doing also the testing, we now have access to those tests. So you can find out if you have an APOE4 allele. For example, I quit alcohol/ I didn’t have an alcohol problem. But about 11 months ago, I realized that for my genetics, alcohol was not ideal for me.

And so, I’ve at least for the last 11 months, stopped drinking. So I think there’s a lot of different things you can do proactively that sort of help, again, maintain your terrain in the best possible ways to give you that resilience. And in essence, you know, I mean, the brain is such a frontier. You know, there’s still so much we don’t understand about it. But the more that you can practice, you know, lifestyle practices, and nutrition, and exercise, you know, increasing BDNF, doing muscle, you know, extending exercises, getting that cardiovascular exercise in, all of those things are integral to creating that terrain that helps to prevent dementia. And then there’s, of course, great supplements. You know, you wanna be getting your, your great clean omega 3s, your vitamin D, B. There’s a whole protocol, which I’ve spoken about. I have a list, if anyone wants to message me, they can feel free to. But, you know, supplementation, nutrition, diet and exercise. Many of the tenants that you are an expert in and talk about frequently on your podcast, those are core tenants, and then looking to the experts. As it relates to, you know, how to prevent if you do have those genetic markers and/or you just have a lot of inflammation, how to get that down so as to kind of help enhance your epigenetics. So that, you know, again, using that analogy, even if you do have a loaded gun, you never have to have pull that trigger.

Katie: So many practical tips, I’ll make sure we’ll link to all of the resources you just mentioned in the show notes at wellnessmama.fm. And as we get toward the end of our time, a question I selfishly love to ask because I’m always looking for new suggestions, if there is a book or a number of books that have dramatically impacted your life, and if so what they are and why?

Michael: Oh many. I have so many books that I love. I think reading is one of the great gifts we have in our time on the planet. I’ll mention a few that I love “The Obstacle Is the Way” by Ryan Holiday. I think it’s an exceptional book. All of us are facing challenges. I know you’ve got a lot of moms listening, that, you know, feel like their time isn’t their own and are pulled in all kinds of directions from their kids that they love dearly. And also, you know, being a parent, a partner, and also trying to manage your own individual desires, challenges, needs. From just an inspirational point of view, I love the book “Love in The Time of Cholera.” I think it’s a beautiful love story with incredibly eloquent prose by Gabrielle García Márquez. I’m about to read “The Overstory Everyone Is Wax Prophetic.” I haven’t read it yet, but I’m about to. I think for men and husbands out there “Way of the Superior Man” is an incredible book by David Deida. It really goes into this notion of what it looks like as it relates to kind of polarities and how to step up into being a more embodied man and owning the embodied masculine. Another great book in that regard is “King Warrior Magician Lover.” In terms of cognitive health, you know, I love Dale Bredesen his book. I think “The Grain Brain” by Dr. David Perlmutter is incredible. You know, there’s a variety of different health resources, books that I love. But, you know, I could go on for ages and ages. The book I’m reading right now is “Braiding Sweetgrass,” which is a really beautiful story. And there’s a book by Boyd Varty. And I just had him on my podcast. He was incredible. He’s actually a lion tracker. He doesn’t hunt lions, but he uses tracking as an analogy for living and talking about being on track and being off track. I can’t remember the exact title. You could probably Google it. I think it’s like “Lion Tracker’s Guide to Life.” You could also find it through my podcast, “Peak Mind,” Boyd Varty. That book blew me away. And I went deep. He did a 40 day Solo Excursion in the bush felt in South Africa and podcasted on it every day. And I listened to that on my road trip. And it was amazing. So, I’ll stop there for now, but those are some of my favorite books.

Katie: Awesome. I’ll make sure all of those are linked in the show notes at wellnessmama.fm. And lastly, if people wanna stay in touch and keep learning from you, where should they start? It sounds like maybe your podcast, “Peak Brain?”

Michael: Yeah, “Peak Mind” is the podcast, “Peak Mind with Michael Trainer. And, yeah, I would love… That’s probably the best place I’m putting out, you know, podcasts weekly, sometimes twice a week. Peakmind.org is the website. And the best way to reach me in terms of messaging is through social media. So I’m just at Michael Trainer, M-I- C-H-A-E-L T-R-A-I-N-E-R on social media across platforms. So feel free to message me. I always love hearing from people. I try to reply to absolutely everyone. So that’s the best way really, and I’m just, you know, like everyone else, you’re just trying my best, working to be the best citizen I can and the best, you know, family member I can. And so I’m very grateful for you to having me on the show because I know… I’ve learned about the show years ago from the folks at Thrive Market, and just heard how passionate, and how committed your audience members are. So, I honor you for being the standard you are in the world.

Katie: Well, thank you so much. And thank you for your time today and for all the work you’re doing in the world.

Michael: Well, thank you. It’s an honor and a pleasure.

Katie: And thank you as always for listening, for sharing your most valuable resource, your time, with both of us today. We’re so grateful that you did, and I hope that you’ll join me again on the next episode of the “Wellness Mama Podcast.”

If you’re enjoying these interviews, would you please take two minutes to leave a rating or review on iTunes for me? Doing this helps more people to find the podcast, which means even more moms and families could benefit from the information. I really appreciate your time, and thanks as always for listening.



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